Our girl Cherry has taken ill and has lost some of her appetite

Post Reply
duskern

Post   » Fri Jan 15, 2021 3:52 am


So what you're saying here Lynx, is that we could probably give her as much as 20 mg/kg q12h? So close to twice of 25 mg/kg q24h.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Fri Jan 15, 2021 7:46 pm


Since it was a direct pull from the Formulary, I think you have to stick with the 12h and should not double it and give it 24h.
Getting 20mg/kg q12h would mean a total 24h dose of 40mg/kg. I think it should still be split. Be very wary of complications (diarrhea and inappetence on Baytril are the most important ones).
http://www.guinealynx.info/antibiotic_advice.html

This is where having a veterinarian determine the appropriate dose is the best choice.

duskern

Post   » Sat Jan 16, 2021 9:10 am


I totally agree. We would never start giving her medication without first consulting our vet. The reason I'm asking is that we were giving her 25 mg/kg q24h, when she was on the medication. Since she isn't on anything right now, it doesn't really matter, but it's still nice to know if the need should arise at a later timer. 20 mg/kg q12h is still quite a bit more than 25 mg/kg q24h, so in case we needed to try something more aggressive at some point, that could be worth trying.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sat Jan 16, 2021 9:39 am


I believe the dose I cited is in the 5th edition of Carpenter's Exotic Animal Formulary. If your vet could get their hands on it, they would have some solid guidelines. Their listing also states:
Very high doses may cause arthropathies in young if given for a prolonged time;
limit SC, IM injections;
SC injections can be diluted in NaCl or lactated Ringer’s solution
Enrofloxacin in liquid form is very caustic and can damage skin - this is why there is a warning to limit SC, IM injections is given. Often treatment is started with a single injection and then the pet caretaker will continue the antibiotic using an oral suspension.

duskern

Post   » Mon Jan 25, 2021 9:47 am


The infection is still there. We could smell the pus yesterday, so we took her to the vet today. She examined her and the wound broke open. She got a cleaning so that's good. Our vet have prescribed her with Zitromax, which is Azithromycin. I hope it can penetrate bone good enough to help with the root cause of the infection.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:46 am


I am glad she was seen by the vet and had the infection cleaned out. I so wish you could come up with a treatment that completely cleared the oral/bone infection (my primary recommendation was antibiotic beads, discussed in some of the topics above).

I am adding a link here to the issues you described over a month ago:
viewtopic.php?p=2314317#p2314317

"Since I first started this thread she has been through more than 5 operations. Our vet is convinced that the problem is some kind of bacterial infection that remains in her bone, after removing a rotten lower front tooth way back. We have had several operations where she has been opened up and cleaned, but it's almost always the same story. We keep cleaning the wound and she slowly recovers. Everything is good until some point when she starts to get worse again, and the wound from the operation springs open, and pus starts to come out. Then we go back to cleaning the wound and trying to remove the pus."

duskern

Post   » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:44 pm


Thx for your concert Lynx. I do remember the idea, and it's still something we are considering. A lot of things you have available in the US or other places are not that easy to come by in Denmark. I discussed it with the vet today actually. She is not against trying it out if we can get a hold of the beads or chloramphenicol. The problem with the beads are that some of the components you can't order as a vet. I might be able to get a hold of some of the stuff, but it wouldn't be entirely legal. Chloramphenicol is the same story. It's only available for human use, so if I were to try to acquire it, It wouldn't be legal, and I would have to get a hold of it somehow.

So, right now we are exploring other options before going down that road. We have not tried azithromycin before, so it's a first both for us and Cherry. We are hoping it will yield some good results before we try something else. Luckily Cherry is not that old, and is actually doing quite fine, besides not eating as a side effect of some of the antibiotics. We are following all advice regarding feeding her that we have from here. As long as we keep giving her 5ml CC/3 hours and FP a couple of times a day, she is pretty stable.

I will keep giving updates here.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:13 pm


The beads can be handmade using a "kit" so they aren't necessarily something you could purchase somewhere. Only other thing I can think of is talk to human pharmacists to see if they can compound something like this.

Just hoping you can clear this up.

duskern

Post   » Thu Jan 28, 2021 3:51 am


I think one of the problems was getting some of the components you had to use for making the beads. I only watched the videos once, I have no real knowledge about such stuff, so I'm not sure what it is that's so hard to come by.

We are currently giving Cherry 5ml CC every three hours until around midnight. Then we let her rest until 8 am and start again. She is still not eating after starting with the Zitromax. I'm trying to encourage her by offering all sorts of foods, but she doesn't seem interested right now. I think it's the medication, since she was eating all right before we started giving it to her. There's not much we can do except keep giving her the medicine + CC and FP.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:57 am


I wonder if pain medication might help. I so hope she can beat this.

duskern

Post   » Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:34 am


We ended up having to stop giving her the medication, as she simply didn't react well to it. She didn't really eat anything after we started giving her Zitromax. We called the vet yesterday with her weight, and she told us to stop it. She is not eating on her own yet, and we suspect that her molars have started to get too long.

It has been increasingly more difficult to get her to chew the CC we give her, so instead of giving her 5ml/3 hours, we now give her as much as we can every 1 or 2 hours. We also have to use the technique for the uncooperative pigs, since if we don't the CC will just be in her mouth without her chewing it. I tried giving her some pain medication, as that often helps when there's problems with the teeth, and she actually started eating a bit. We are hoping this will help her get through the weekend, until we can get her to the vet on Monday.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:14 am


I hope clearing her of the antibiotic really helps with her appetite.

duskern

Post   » Sun Jan 31, 2021 9:42 am


I'm not entirely sure that the antibiotics have cleared yet. She seems to not be feeling good. We are giving her pain medication as well now, as someone I know mentioned that it could be her teeth, due to her not really eating anything for 5 days. It seems to have helped a bit on her overall, and she has eaten a bit of cucumber and hay. She's not really eating much though. I've tried with all sorts of stuff, and although she seems interested sometimes when I bring them food, she doesn't want to eat anything after all.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sun Jan 31, 2021 10:31 pm


You are hand feeding and weighing daily, I imagine. Is she losing weight? If she can eat hay, that is wonderful and would help keep her teeth in check. I think you said earlier you are syringing Critical Care. Getting food into her is so important. I am sorry she is having these issues.

duskern

Post   » Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:59 pm


She is currently not really eating anything. She takes a bit of cucumber every now and then, but that's about it. We are hand feeding her from morning to night when we go to bed. 5 ml CC every 3 hours + 1 ml FP three times a day. The vet seems to think that it's still the Zitromax that's causing her to not have any appetite, even though she did find out that her molars have indeed gotten a bit longer. We are getting that fixed tomorrow. Is there anything I can do to keep her weight if she is not eating anything other than CC and a bit of FP? I will have to weigh her tomorrow. I have a bit of an issue with the weighing, as knowing the number actually gives me anxiety. Getting the wife do that when all is chaos at home with two sick children and a pig is not easy. Everything is pretty [expletive deleted] up right now. I will try to do it tomorrow. My guess would be that she's losing weight at the moment.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:59 pm


Your current hand feeding is so important. I am sorry your children are ill. It can seem overwhelming to have so many things going on in our lives.

I would try to get in the habit of weighing a couple times a day. Work out a simple method, say using a reliable electronic kitchen scale that can be tared out. You would put something like a bread pan on it to zero out the weight of the pan. Put your guinea pig in the pan and do a quick weight. Aim for the same time of day, say before or after you have fed her. There will be fluctuations but you are looking for a pattern of loss t worry. Perhaps you have read this page?
http://www.guinealynx.info/weigh.html

I so hope she improves.

duskern

Post   » Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:46 am


It's hard to remember to do, because there's always something stressful going on with work or the children, but I will try. We have a good method with a kitchen scale and a paper box. We have used it for years. Thx for all your advice Lynx. I just hope we can keep her alive for some time, if she continues to not want to eat.

bpatters
And got the T-shirt

Post   » Tue Feb 02, 2021 9:37 am


Five cc's of CC every three hours isn't enough. The recommended daily dose is 100 cc per day for a 1 kilogram pig, adjusted up or down for the weight of the pig, and down if the pig is eating anything on its own.

duskern

Post   » Fri Feb 05, 2021 8:34 am


We have increased accordingly. We did also increase it from 5 to 10 ml every 3 hours the other day, so now she is gaining in weight it seems. She's still not really eating and not super interested in food most of the time. Every now and then she seems to be really interested and will stand at the gate to the cage when I come with some food, but then she usually just smells it and runs away. The only thing I can get her to eat is cucumber, but since she has had her teeth shortened because they were growing inwards a bit and was really long, I have to cut it so it's kinda mushy, in order for her to really get something bitten off. She is good right now at eating the CC, so that's always something.

duskern

Post   » Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:44 am


So a short update about Cherry. She is doing well right now. We have stopped giving her CC, FP and medication since she is eating normally. She has regained all her lost weight as well. Her wound has closed up, as we have seen some times before. It feels like everything is ok right now. We are hoping that the treatment with Zitromax has had an effect, but time will tell. If not the next thing to try would be for me to acquire the materials for doing antibiotic beads, namely chloramphenicol and bone cement. Like I mentioned before, vets can't order this stuff in Denmark for some reason. It would be confiscated in customs. Our vet have however agreed to help us with such a treatment, given that we can come by the materials ourselves. I'm hoping it won't come to this, since I have no clue as to where I would buy this stuff, and also how to get it to Denmark without being confiscated in customs.

Post Reply
153 posts